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Charlie Kirk Shot Dead in Assassination | Sep. 10th-21st/2025 | Discussions Closed

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7gtz said:
I'm being conservative with my assessment - I have nothing to prove that 7-10 illegal arms figure except my own personal experiences and anecdotes. It's sort of an unspoken truth here. I live in Delhi which has one of the highest gun rates in the country which likely also introduces bias into my judgement, hence I tried to compensate for that with the lower number!
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Okay, well; you shouldn't be citing numbers that appear to look precise without having a reliable source to fall back on. I really thought this was sourced - and since it's you, I took you on your word. Please don't erode this trust.

People pulling numbers out of their asses is how much of the craziness we're currently facing got started.
 
Both parties suck 💩🍑.

I’m just waiting for the two party system to put the final nail in America’s coffin as we are all slowly being lowered into the six foot hole no thanks to ourselves, not a foreign power. It feels like we are all being buried alive frankly.

👉 That’s why I’ve given up on politics and in turn, given up on America, look at us, we are fucked because of the two party system, and imho past the point of no return.

I’m just waiting for the two party system to finish the job...

Anyways I will continue to stay out of and ignore this thread and all politics here as politics in America has become entirly fruitless endeavor and a lost cause.

Just saw RiffRaff posting, always enjoy his commentary, and wanted to add to what he said.
 
Socom7 said:
In a couple days' time none of this will matter, and people will struggle to remember who either of those guys was.
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It will matter. People may struggle to remember the assassins name, but to many of us , which seems to escape you, Charlie Kirk was like Robert Kennedy getting killed (very differnt beliefs). He was a presidential aspirant and very important to conservative republicans.
 
Socom7 said:
In a couple days' time none of this will matter, and people will struggle to remember who either of those guys was.
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This is rather cynical. Please allow me to add to it :)
The Twittersphere (X-Sphere?), memesphere, and certain extreme media outlets might not let us forget. Or at least might not let certain elements of society forget....
 
Socom7 said:
Okay, well; you shouldn't be citing numbers that appear to look precise without having a reliable source to fall back on. I really thought this was sourced - and since it's you, I took you on your word. Please don't erode this trust.

People pulling numbers out of their asses is how much of the craziness we're currently facing got started.
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Noted. You're quite right, and I do appreciate that trust. Next time, I'll clarify if my claims aren't well sourced.

Due to the nature of illegally registered weapons, all we can do really is estimate. The point still stands, however - illegal firearms are indeed present in far larger quantities than legal ones.

The issue is, in India, you cannot really trust institutional numbers and government estimates, because politicians don't want to look bad to avoid giving their opponents any ammunition. You need to rely on your own experience - having official sources means nothing. The experience I cite is based off my father's side having a long career in the Indian Police Service. There is no reliable source.

I agree with you - we shouldn't be pulling numbers out of nowhere. But it's all we have here, and I daresay more reliable than the official number. The number I gave you was calculated and I did search through numerous news articles to arrive at that conclusion supplemented by the information I've been exposed to due to my family's police background.
 
teekay99 said:
This is rather cynical. Please allow me to add to it :)
The Twittersphere (X-Sphere?), memesphere, and certain extreme media outlets might not let us forget. Or at least might not let certain elements of society forget....
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Extreme media outlets? Please be so kind as to name a few of those. Also if you could throw in a few that will let us forget that would be super!

I would love to compare the list in a few years.
 
RiffRaff said:
As a "moderate centrist," I agree with some moderate liberal philosophies and some moderate conservative philosophies. However, I disagree with the extremism of both the far-left and far-right. For instance, I am a firm believer in the Second Amendment (conservative). However, I also recognize that the phrase "well-regulated" is part of the Second Amendment, so I therefore support some very basic, common sense laws on gun ownership (liberal). I also support basic universal health care (liberal), but if the wealthy want so-called "Cadillac plans" through private insurance companies, I see no reason to interfere with that (conservative).

I don't know if we're talking about the same thing and just using different terminology, but I hope my explanation cleared it up.
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We probably are, since I agree with most of your views. I, too, believe that as long as certain conditions are met it's generally fine for private citizens to own guns - however, I would be against unrestricted constitutional access to guns, because clearly there are individuals out there who need to be kept away from guns. I'll even admit that there are places where ownership of guns may solve more problems than it causes (for example, sparsely populated countryside where the nearest police station is an hour's drive away - but not a metropolitan downtown area). As regards healthcare, I support a public system where everyone is entitled to a basic level of care at the taxpayer's expense - and I'm also fine with private healtcare facilities for the moneyed individual. I have nothing against LGBT+ folks (under the "it's none of my f*****g business" clause), but I'm also fine with people who practice religion - and in both cases this tolerance extends to public expression of one's identity (within reason). And so on and so forth. Call it what you may, I call it liberal centrism.

By "symmetrist" I mean someone who looks at both sides of the political spectrum, and comes to the conclusion that they're equally guilty of the Bad Stuff that's going on. I am not a symmetrist. I believe that, at least in the US, one side is currently more guilty of inciting political violence than the other. If that's where we differ, well, so be it. 💁‍♂️
 
Socom7 said:
By "symmetrist" I mean someone who looks at both sides of the political spectrum, and comes to the conclusion that they're equally guilty of the Bad Stuff that's going on. I am not a symmetrist. I believe that, at least in the US, one side is currently more guilty of inciting political violence than the other. If that's where we differ, well, so be it.
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Regardless of how true this is (and no, the purpose of this post is not to agree or to disagree with it), assigning guilt/blame only fuels further division. Both sides feel like the other is more guilty than they are, and there's no convincing them otherwise. There is no option other than forgiving what has already happened and working with a clean slate, IMHO.
 
7gtz said:
Noted. You're quite right, and I do appreciate that trust. Next time, I'll clarify if my claims aren't well sourced.

Due to the nature of illegally registered weapons, all we can do really is estimate. The point still stands, however - illegal firearms are indeed present in far larger quantities than legal ones.

The issue is, in India, you cannot really trust institutional numbers and government estimates, because politicians don't want to look bad to avoid giving their opponents any ammunition. You need to rely on your own experience - having official sources means nothing. The experience I cite is based off my father's side having a long career in the Indian Police Service. There is no reliable source.
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Thanks. I understand - and, like I said, I agree with your point about there being statistically less political violence in present-day India than in the US.
 
teekay99 said:
This is rather cynical. Please allow me to add to it :)
The Twittersphere (X-Sphere?), memesphere, and certain extreme media outlets might not let us forget. Or at least might not let certain elements of society forget....
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Yes, I'm a very cynical individual, aren't I? :)

But that's the way things are. We're simply lurching from crisis to crisis - without learning anything, and seemingly without even remembering anything. Modern societies have the attention span of a goldfish; they're always chasing the Next Big Story. And since in a democracy the political class has to listen to what the society demands, they, too, are incapable of any long-term planning.

This is no way to run a country.
 
Torch said:
Extreme media outlets? Please be so kind as to name a few of those. Also if you could throw in a few that will let us forget that would be super!

I would love to compare the list in a few years.
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Can I back down by saying we are wandering off topic? I was after all being cynical 🤡. @DarkNoon is going to smite me for taking us off subject :) j/k

Never Forget Category:
  • Alex Jones / InfoWars
  • I'm starting to put Tucker Carlson and Glenn Beck in this category
  • PMSNBC (whenever Rachel Maddow wants an example to criticize conservatives for blaming democrats)
Probably Will Let Us Forget Category (because they will move on to the next news story which is what I think @Socom7 was trying to argue):
  • ABC (US)
  • NBC
  • CBS
 
Sorry for this being in reports just asking if anyone has any sort of transcripts for said discord messages? I’m curious because it appears this is attached to Mormonism which is often seen as a cult, can help explain actions. So I’m curious if these messages are continued versions of the antifascist messaging (which is heavily filled with memery and internet cultures) or show some level of either lashing out against their parents and Mormonism as well, or even Mormon extremism though that seems unlikely but possible in this case.
7gtz said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1966514908734111950
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Ben Dhyani said:
Fwiw, this is a vid of Tylor in a debate with Charlie, it was probably Tylor's ignominious departure that was most likely the reason for this later assassination....
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Do you have a source that is Tyler besides him kinda looking like him?
 
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william said:
Facts are facts :mad:
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1: When Lincoln was shot in 1865, Republicans were liberal and Democrats were conservative. So, you're not exactly supporting your argument with that example.
2: Reagan was shot by a mentally deranged individual and it had zero to do with politics.
3: There is conflicting evidence on whether or not Trump was actually hit, although the attempt was certainly made.
4: We still don't have enough information on Kirk's shooter yet to say for certain it was politically motivated. It *probably* was, but it's irresponsible to claim that as fact yet.
 
I'm sorry. I have to say this. Feel free to put this in another thread altogether in an entirely different section for all I care, but there are so many contradicting "new" facts about this, and the fact that he had a Trans friend or partner does no ot make what he did worse or make the latter complicit in it. How quick some people are to blame the LBTQ community for this or trans individuals in entirety are making me (as a bisexual person, too) seriously scared for the safety of my friends in the US who aren't straight and might be waring anything that signifies this in the US. It's too early for institutional prosecution yet, it's not existential so far, but obviously a rollback of rights. However, I can see a sharp rise in hate crime of feminine looking males or people having anything remotely rainbow-coloured as "revenge".
 
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