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German Tanks Roll Into Poland, Russia Issues Warning

ArmyATC

ArmyATC

Power Poster
Joined
Mar 17, 2015
Poland
THE tiny Polish town of Swietoszow did not officially exist during the Cold War; as home to a massive but secret Soviet tank force ready to strike at the West, it was removed from all public maps and records.

Last week Nato used the base for the first big deployment of a new special force to defend eastern Europe from an increasingly expansionist Russia.

American Black Hawk helicopters thundered in the skies as German tanks rolled from across the nearby border, along with troops and hardware from seven other nations that make up Nato’s Spearhead Force, which was set up last year in response to Russia’s intervention in Ukraine
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http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/world_news/Europe/article1568452.ece?CMP=OTH-gnws-standard-2015_06_14


And


RF Respone
MOSCOW (Reuters) - A senior Russian Defense Ministry official warned on Monday that Moscow would boost its forces on its Western flank should the United States store heavy arms in the Baltic states and eastern Europe.

A U.S. official said over the weekend that Washington planned to store heavy military equipment in the Baltics and eastern Europe to reassure allies unnerved by Russia's role in Ukraine and to deter aggression.

The Russian official, General Yuri Yakubov, was quoted as saying any such move would be "the most aggressive step by the Pentagon and NATO" since the Cold War.

"Russia would be left with no other option but to boost its troops and forces on the western flank," Yakubov was quoted as saying by the Interfax news agency.

Russia will have no option but to build up its forces and resources on the Western strategic front," Interfax news agency quoted him as saying.

He said the Russian response was likely to include speeding up the deployment of Iskander missiles to Kaliningrad, a Russian exclave bordered by Poland and Lithuania, and beefing up Russian forces in ex-Soviet Belarus.

"Our hands are completely free to organize retaliatory steps to strengthen our Western frontiers," Yakubov said.
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Well here we go.. Just how large is this NATO 'spearhead'. We are getting conflicting reports, thus is this a cover to pre-position NATO not only in the Baltics, but in all Eastern Europe?

On the Russian side, are they just responding, or are they, too using this to heavily militarize the region? Dangerous games we are playing, especially if we have concluded by consensus this will start conventionally, right?

WHY THE RUSH?

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/kremlin-declines-u-plans-store-arms-baltics-eastern-102626443--business.html
 
I do not know what is the situation in other countries from eastern Europe is , but I know what is the situation in my country - Bulgaria
Since the start of 2015 , more than 200 armored vehicles (tanks, APCs , armored med vehicles ) have been deployed all over the country

So far I abstained from posting here , since the cheerleading for NATO is too much to bare , but I can't stay silent anymore
Here is a link containing images of what has been deployed all over the country since January 2015

http://goo.gl/YdLqWd

When one scrolls down after the 1st 3 images of people protesting against NATO there is a series of images that shows what I am talking about
And this article is in Bulgarian , but the images speak for themselves .

The issue I have with all of this is that the machines and troops are de-facto already deployed - what are they doing now is announcing it to the general audience .


Take this as you will .
 
YARS24 said:
I do not know what is the situation in other countries from eastern Europe is , but I know what is the situation in my country - Bulgaria
Since the start of 2015 , more than 200 armored vehicles (tanks, APCs , armored med vehicles ) have been deployed all over the country

So far I abstained from posting here , since the cheerleading for NATO is too much to bare , but I can't stay silent anymore
Here is a link containing images of what has been deployed all over the country since January 2015

http://goo.gl/YdLqWd

When one scrolls down after the 1st 3 images of people protesting against NATO there is a series of images that shows what I am talking about
And this article is in Bulgarian , but the images speak for themselves .

The issue I have with all of this is that the machines and troops are de-facto already deployed - what are they doing now is announcing it to the general audience .


Take this as you will .
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Thank you for your post. I, for one, am no cheerleader for expansionism by either NATO or Russia. I feel the Bulgarian people should decide.

And I absolutely agree, that's why I asked just how large is this 'spearhead' and is it being used for a much bigger, de-facto deployment. Apparently, your input is a very valuable piece of the puzzle. So I implore you to not pass generalized judgements on all Americans for something we, the people, have no say in.

Keep in mind, the 'USA,USA,USA' crowd is just plain uninformed and brainwashed by years of propaganda. No excuse, just the facts. No one wants peace more than a soldier or veteran, I promise you...


But, if you can get past this perception (which may be true in some posts), I, for one, would love to have Bulgarian input. I have fought under the flag of NATO, and am well aware of their politics. So please don't judge all Americans as supporting any act by NATO, Russia, China or anyone that makes the world less secure.

That being said, if Bulgaria wants or needs NATO, I will support it if the Bulgarians do. Did the Bulgarian people get a Vote in the decision to join NATO? If not, you see my point. If you did, then if you want out, start a recall petition. And then you will see how helpless we all are to these powers.


Just to let you know, one of the pics has "2/2 CAV" on the bumper. This is an US infantry Stryker Cavalry Unit out of Vilseck, GER.. Thought you would like to know..
 
First of all , thank you for being a voice of reason (lately that is so rare )
The people here have never been asked if we want to join NATO , or the EU for that matter
And now , when there are protests ongoing since January (every Sunday since the mid of the month) and they ask for referendum on both there is no answer from the powers elect .

What is annoying the hell out of me is that outside of my circle of friends , very few people get the gravity of the situation we are in at the moment .

The battle is , naturally , for money and influence .
 
Yes, this is a very grave situation. Americans have no say in NATO, this TPP Secret Trade Deal, or anything else either. Even if we did, most of us are in your situation, outside a few informed people, most just want to watch basketball, talk about gay marriage, and pretend the economy is growing instead of imploding.

Most are fooled into thinking 'maybe the next election will change things', thus still believing there is a real difference between our political parties..sad and dangerous.

I know your country is very beautiful and the people are some of the most caring in Europe. Your country was forced to accept terms dictated to it, under threat of intentional destabilization by 'terrorists' these powers seem to carry around in their back pocket.

And I as well appreciate a voice of reason, especially since you are in a much better position to try and help the Americans that know how wrong this is. I don't know the answers, but I do know we've identified the basic problem.. Greed and control.

There are no solutions to such things, since they are indicators of a spiritual sickness, not a political dysfunction. Now, I am afraid, we can only warn others without sounding crazy and prepare our loved ones.

Thank you, again.
 
Keep in mind, the 'USA,USA,USA' crowd is just plain uninformed and brainwashed by years of propaganda.
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I agree to a point. Most people under 40 years old are to young to really remember the Cold War and they think this is a game of Call of Duty or something and that is naive and misguided. Also, they have been brainwashed by the "Russia is our friend" propaganda. However, you and I have lived thru the Cold War and we both know what Russia is capable of doing. I would much rather have our military mentality we did in the 1980s rather than the political mentality of today's world. So, while I would not like a war with Russia, we should prepare as if it will happen.

I have always respected your comments, opinions and continue to do so.

On a side note, I really wonder how some of our friends in Poland feel about German tanks rolling back into the country. Must be really strange.
 
YARS24 said:
First of all , thank you for being a voice of reason (lately that is so rare )
The people here have never been asked if we want to join NATO , or the EU for that matter
And now , when there are protests ongoing since January (every Sunday since the mid of the month) and they ask for referendum on both there is no answer from the powers elect .

What is annoying the hell out of me is that outside of my circle of friends , very few people get the gravity of the situation we are in at the moment .

The battle is , naturally , for money and influence .
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FWIW, the Bulgarian leader seems about as enthusiastic as UK Foreign Sec when he was asked about basing US nuclear missiless...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/15/us-russia-usa-europe-idUSKBN0OV17A20150615
Bulgaria and Hungary both say they are committed members of the alliance, but they have maintained close cultural and commercial ties to Moscow, and may not want to jeopardize those links by storing U.S. military equipment on their soil.

Rosen Plevneliev, the Bulgarian President, said it was too early to say if his country would join the Pentagon's initiative.

"At the current moment there is no proposal whatsoever to the Bulgarian government upon which we can start discussions," he said.
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This seems like a rash action. As we've seen, this will clearly be seen as an offensive action by the RF and consequently, will only worsen tensions which are already at a new high.
 
All sorts of problems worry me about this deployment...

It's a shedload of heavy weaponry, but no actual US troops... so who is going to guard it all? The Lithuanian/Polish armies? Private security? I'm sure Russian intelligence would find out pretty quickly where it's all stored, it's not an easy thing to hide, so if war were to break out, surely the first thing Russia would do would be to fire a load of missiles at this store and wipe it out before the Americans arrived to use any of it? It seems this step is neither one thing nor the other... not enough to provide a guarantee of security for these countries, but enough to annoy the Russians... actually, the Russians almost certainly knew about it anyway, but it enables them to play their 'we're mad as hell and we're not gonna take this anymore' card in the propaganda war again.

The Russians seem to have concoted a weird idea that Poland and Lithuania are capable of teaming up to annex Kaliningrad! Check this out -

http://europe.newsweek.com/hackers-post-bogus-plan-attack-russia-lithuanian-defence-ministry-site-328583

But look how Sputnik reported it - hackers got into the Lithuanian Defense Ministry system 'and found a pledge to annex Kaliningrad' - the one the hackers put there themselves of course, but there's nothing like twisting the facts! :lol:

http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150611/1023226099.html

Going back to this weapons store, the lead time for the US to get it all there... it's almost like saying to Russia - 'last call to invade the Baltics, Vladimir!' If he had any plans for a quick annexation, he would surely enact them now, and then what is the US going to do?

And finally, I can understand YARS24's concern... everything these days seems to come from the Pentagon. Not NATO sources, or even US executive, but the US military. It fits in with the idea that Obama is so disengaged with Europe that the Pentagon has virtually taken over European policy themselves. The idea that this 'still needs WH approval' seems a bit moot, as the leak - and the contributions from Polish and Lithuanian spokesmen - have virtually bounced Obama into this anyway. The Pentagon has lost (or so far, anyway) on the whole 'arms to Ukraine' thing, so it's making sure it has the upper hand on this.
 
*Insert 'I did nazi that coming, did jew?' meme here* (sorry lol)

But man, I'm honestly shocked NATO is doing all this. Hey, Russia thinks NATO is weak.... guess he got proved wrong.
 
Honestly, arming nearly all of Eastern Europe seems a little excessive for what we know Russia has done so far. Almost as if they know of a provaction that Russia has made that we don't know about... :?
 
jjjppp11 said:
Honestly, arming nearly all of Eastern Europe seems a little excessive for what we know Russia has done so far. Almost as if they know of a provaction that Russia has made that we don't know about... :?
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Agreed. Although this could be a maneuver for Russia to back off, so the move could (and this is a big unlikely could) be peaceful in some manner.
 
jayfeather31 said:
jjjppp11 said:
Honestly, arming nearly all of Eastern Europe seems a little excessive for what we know Russia has done so far. Almost as if they know of a provaction that Russia has made that we don't know about... :?
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Agreed. Although this could be a maneuver for Russia to back off, so the move could (and this is a big unlikely could) be peaceful in some manner.
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That is true. It could me a number of things really...At least for all we know.
 
Historically, Russia only responds to force...the sanctions were a joke. NATO should have done this from the start, now it may be too late.
 
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/opinion/news/article/putin-russia-would-direct-armed-forces-at-aggressors/523811.html

Well, we knew this pretty much already but Putin basically put the Baltics, Poland, Romania, Ukraine etc in the bullseye.

Also, note his veiled warning to Finland..........that they should remain NEUTRAL.
 
Missileman said:
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/opinion/news/article/putin-russia-would-direct-armed-forces-at-aggressors/523811.html

Well, we knew this pretty much already but Putin basically put the Baltics, Poland, Romania, Ukraine etc in the bullseye.

Also, note his veiled warning to Finland..........that they should remain NEUTRAL.
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This bit is more immediately worrying...
On the Ukraine crisis, he repeated that Russia wanted Ukraine to repay the $3 billion it lent to Kiev via a so-called "bailout bond" under former President Viktor Yanukovych.

"We have the right to demand early repayment of these funds, but we haven't done that due to the difficult state of the Ukrainian economy," Putin said.
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So here come the bailiffs... in tanks... :?
 
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