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UA-RU-NATO War & Ukraine Peace Talks | Discussions

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RiffRaff

RiffRaff

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New thread. Old one was getting derailed.

For the record, if a statement of fact is made without supporting evidence and someone else asks for the source, it is customary to post that source for analysis. I don't care if you're using a Commodore 64 or an Etch-A-Sketch. Post supporting sources of claims.
 
RiffRaff said:
New thread. Old one was getting derailed.

For the record, if a statement of fact is made without supporting evidence and someone else asks for the source, it is customary to post that source for analysis. I don't care if you're using a Commodore 64 or an Etch-A-Sketch. Post supporting sources of claims.
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U tube. 😉🤝👍oh I'm not easily offended either. Being called a liar . Obviously not an issue here.
 
Snowfall said:
I’ll make my last statement then I’m done. YouTube isn’t a source it’s a website. YouTube as a whole is not a specific video, it’s not a statement, it’s not evidence. It’s a search engine to find evidence.
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Not sure how that clears up anything for me. I probably just don't understand. But thankyou for trying to explain. I won't call you a liar though. Just because I don't understand. Search engine for evidence yet not evidence? Ok got it. 😉👍
 
Yingyang said:
Not sure how that clears up anything for me. I probably just don't understand. But thankyou for trying to explain. I won't call you a liar though. Just because I don't understand. Search engine for evidence yet not evidence? Ok got it. 😉👍
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Snowfall is correct. Simply posting a link to a YouTube video is not confirmation, especially if that video was posted by a questionable source.

If you are going to use a YouTube video to back up a claim, please add some context regarding who made the video. For instance, a YouTube video by Canadian Prepper is an automatic conspiracy theory.
 
RiffRaff said:
Snowfall is correct. Simply posting a link to a YouTube video is not confirmation, especially if that video was posted by a questionable source.

If you are going to use a YouTube video to back up a claim, please add some context regarding who made the video. For instance, a YouTube video by Canadian Prepper is an automatic conspiracy theory.
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I looked up Canadian prepper.
Salesperson. Probably relies on panic for financial gains.
Thankyou for your explanation.
So simply quote the source on the u-tube video is good enough.
I don't need to post the video as that is my issue. Thankyou again 👍🤝
 
Yingyang said:
I looked up Canadian prepper.
Salesperson. Probably relies on panic for financial gains.
Thankyou for your explanation.
So simply quote the source on the u-tube video is good enough.
I don't need to post the video as that is my issue. Thankyou again 👍🤝
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I would post the link to the video, along with some brief context on its content and origins.
 
RiffRaff said:
I would post the link to the video, along with some brief context on its content and origins.
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Bugger that , those things have to many letters, numbers and squiggly things to remember or write down and repeat on a keyboard. I gave up that idea along time ago. Never attempted sharing a link here for that reason. Way to much fucking around. 🙄🤷🏻‍♂️. Yep never happen from me. Thanks anyway. I have enough problems with email addresses, what your talking about is far beyond my ability.
 
Yingyang said:
Bugger that , those things have to many letters, numbers and squiggly things to remember or write down and repeat on a keyboard. I gave up that idea along time ago. Never attempted sharing a link here for that reason. Way to much fucking around. 🙄🤷🏻‍♂️. Yep never happen from me. Thanks anyway. I have enough problems with email addresses, what your talking about is far beyond my ability.
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Then you might want to prepare yourself for unsubstantiated posts being deleted as conspiracy theory or unverifiable. That is well within *my* ability.

Now, let's return this thread to its intended purpose.
 
Peter Griffin said:
Both of you are wrong. They fire around 6?
  • S-8 (80mm) rockets: These are a common and favored munition for the Mi-24.

  • S-13 (122mm) rockets: These rockets are also available for the Mi-24, offering a larger payload.
-at the beginning of the video. And then you see the flares. Watch closer.

The reason they don't fly like normal rockets is because Soviet and Ukrainian doctrine uses attack helicopters in an immediate indirect fire capacity. When mortars or arty are not available they fire these rockets from about 2 kms away.
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Here is another daylight video of the same process, this time from the Russian POV. And also showing effect on target. Saturation and denial of movement are the goal with these strikes, not precision or target liquidation, and it has proven its worth many many different times for both sides.
 
Peter Griffin said:
Here is another daylight video of the same process, this time from the Russian POV. And also showing effect on target. Saturation and denial of movement are the goal with these strikes, not precision or target liquidation, and it has proven its worth many many different times for both sides.
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rumble.com

Russian Mi-28 and Ka-52 helicopters fire unguided rockets from a pitch-up position

In the second part of the video, through the eye of the thermal camera we see the launch and the rockets dispersion on target. https://weaponsystems.net/system/183-80mm%20S-8 https://en.wikipedia.org/
rumble.com rumble.com
 
Peter Griffin said:
Sidenote, does anyone here else think Ukraine should get Apaches?
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While I support all viable support to facilitate Ukraine. I question the interim impact Apache’s might bring to the battlefield.

Here is my reasoning, they are absolutely a potent platform. But they are also best used as a fluidly integrated weapon to a integrated command and control system.

They are not just an independent sledge hammer out their randomly searching for targets.
Given the cost of Apache’s. Maintenance needs. That collective expense might be better used in different weapons systems that principally act as hammers in the fight.

Now all that said if Ukraines C&C had risen to a sufficient level combined forces management. I am just not sure any of us can know or determine if Ukraines military is there yet.
This is in no way criticism of Ukraines military. It’s simply a matter of evolution of a militaries capabilities.

Imagine if the cost of 1 or 2 Apaches were dedicated to massive number of drones with warhead deployment. Ukraine seems to be exceedingly adept at using drones, capitalize on there successes.
Just a thought
 
OReid said:
While I support all viable support to facilitate Ukraine. I question the interim impact Apache’s might bring to the battlefield.

Here is my reasoning, they are absolutely a potent platform. But they are also best used as a fluidly integrated weapon to a integrated command and control system.

They are not just an independent sledge hammer out their randomly searching for targets.
Given the cost of Apache’s. Maintenance needs. That collective expense might be better used in different weapons systems that principally act as hammers in the fight.

Now all that said if Ukraines C&C had risen to a sufficient level combined forces management. I am just not sure any of us can know or determine if Ukraines military is there yet.
This is in no way criticism of Ukraines military. It’s simply a matter of evolution of a militaries capabilities.

Imagine if the cost of 1 or 2 Apaches were dedicated to massive number of drones with warhead deployment. Ukraine seems to be exceedingly adept at using drones, capitalize on there successes.
Just a thought
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They also would be quite easy for the Russians to shoot down with the lack of Ukrainian air superiority.
 
Snowfall said:
They also would be quite easy for the Russians to shoot down with the lack of Ukrainian air superiority.
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If used properly by the veteran UAF MI24 pilots I feel like throwing a couple their way could help in a small way, albeit quite useful in a pinch.
 
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