🗣️ | US-Israel/Iran | Rapid Escalation of Targets & Rhetoric | ANALYSIS OF REPORTS

[RiffRaff]

They always have the option to raise the white flag. I'm sure the US would be more than happy to rebuild anything we broke. IMO
Would iran destroy US infrastructure if they could?

Absolutely, and don't assume they can't. They have a decent cyber warfare system in place.

 

[Publius]

Destroying a country's civilian infrastructure is a war crime and a crime against humanity; I understand why Rubio wants to dismantle the ICC. If the US does it, the whole world will want to tear your head off.

Aside from just blurting it out can you provide historical context and examples from any nation, conflict or time period where destroying civilian infrastructure is a war crime. Let alone a crime against humanity.

 

[Winnitude]

Aside from just blurting it out can you provide historical context and examples from any nation, conflict or time period where destroying civilian infrastructure is a war crime. Let alone a crime against humanity.

https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/ru/customary-ihl/v2/rule54

The Geneva convention. It's been a war crime since war crimes have existed. They are not just "blurting it out".

Stanislav Galić is an example where this rule was brought in to his tribunal

It also counts as war by starvation if the infrastructure is required for food which is indeed a crime against humanity. Netanyahu's warrant is for this, Milorad Krnojelac was tried for this as well.

Now, If you're looking for a good example of international law being effectively applied against a nation like the USA for war crimes you'd be hard pressed, but that doesn't mean that war crimes don't exist, just that they're poorly enforced due to the obvious reasons. You really have to lose a war and be put in the position to have other nations enforce these rules after the fact, otherwise the perpetrators just have to not set foot in any nation which intends to enforce these laws.

But, if we go by the idea that because nobody has the power to enforce against the USA right now that they dont exist, then child soldiers, chemical weapons, indiscriminately killing civilians, etc aren't war crimes either, in fact by that reasoning nothing is a crime ever because someone is powerful enough to get away with it, which would be nonsense; it means there are no consequences for them, but those around them would be right to morally condemn them and point out that they are criminals who are unfortunately above the law for x or y reason

 

[GBS61]

À part tout simplement lâcher, pouvez-vous fournir un contexte historique et des exemples de n’importe quelle nation, conflit ou époque où la destruction d’infrastructures civiles est un crime de guerre ? Sans parler d’un crime contre l’humanité.

The list is extremely long.

Famous historical examples:
The Nanking Massacre (1937): Mass atrocities and looting committed by the Japanese army in China.
The Katyn Massacre (1940):

Execution of thousands of Polish officers by the Soviet secret service.
The Oradour-sur-Glane Massacre (1944):

Destruction of a French village and massacre of its 643 inhabitants by a Waffen-SS unit.

Committed by the USA:
Throughout their history, the armed forces and intelligence services of the United States have been accused or found guilty of several serious violations of the laws of war.

The Vietnam War

The My Lai Massacre (1968):
U.S. Army soldiers massacred between 347 and 504 unarmed civilians, primarily women, children, and the elderly, in the village of My Lai. Only one officer, Lieutenant William Calley, was convicted by the U.S. military justice system.

The Massive Use of Agent Orange: The deliberate spraying of millions of liters of this toxic defoliant destroyed ecosystems and poisoned the Vietnamese civilian population, causing cancer and severe birth defects across generations.

The Vietnam War

The My Lai Massacre (1968): U.S. Army soldiers massacred between 347 and 504 unarmed civilians, primarily women, children, and the elderly, in the village of My Lai. Only one officer, Lieutenant William Calley, was convicted by a U.S. military court.

The Korean War

The No Gun Ri Massacre (1950): At the beginning of the conflict, American soldiers from the 7th Cavalry Regiment opened fire on Korean civilian refugees under a railway bridge, killing between 250 and 300 people. The existence of this massacre was officially acknowledged by the U.S. government in 2001.

World War II: The Biscari Massacre (1943): During the invasion of Sicily, soldiers of the U.S. 45th Infantry Division summarily executed 74 Italian prisoners of war and two German prisoners after their surrender. The debate over the atomic bombings (1945): Although they were never prosecuted, the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which caused the instant death of more than 100,000 civilians, are considered by many historians and legal experts to be war crimes due to their disproportionate and indiscriminate nature.

 

[william]

The list is extremely long.

Famous historical examples:
The Nanking Massacre (1937): Mass atrocities and looting committed by the Japanese army in China.
The Katyn Massacre (1940):

Execution of thousands of Polish officers by the Soviet secret service.
The Oradour-sur-Glane Massacre (1944):

Destruction of a French village and massacre of its 643 inhabitants by a Waffen-SS unit.

Committed by the USA:
Throughout their history, the armed forces and intelligence services of the United States have been accused or found guilty of several serious violations of the laws of war.

The Vietnam War

The My Lai Massacre (1968):
U.S. Army soldiers massacred between 347 and 504 unarmed civilians, primarily women, children, and the elderly, in the village of My Lai. Only one officer, Lieutenant William Calley, was convicted by the U.S. military justice system.

The Massive Use of Agent Orange: The deliberate spraying of millions of liters of this toxic defoliant destroyed ecosystems and poisoned the Vietnamese civilian population, causing cancer and severe birth defects across generations.

The Vietnam War

The My Lai Massacre (1968): U.S. Army soldiers massacred between 347 and 504 unarmed civilians, primarily women, children, and the elderly, in the village of My Lai. Only one officer, Lieutenant William Calley, was convicted by a U.S. military court.

The Korean War

The No Gun Ri Massacre (1950): At the beginning of the conflict, American soldiers from the 7th Cavalry Regiment opened fire on Korean civilian refugees under a railway bridge, killing between 250 and 300 people. The existence of this massacre was officially acknowledged by the U.S. government in 2001.

World War II: The Biscari Massacre (1943): During the invasion of Sicily, soldiers of the U.S. 45th Infantry Division summarily executed 74 Italian prisoners of war and two German prisoners after their surrender. The debate over the atomic bombings (1945): Although they were never prosecuted, the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which caused the instant death of more than 100,000 civilians, are considered by many historians and legal experts to be war crimes due to their disproportionate and indiscriminate nature.

Got it! War is bad! Especially for civilians.

 

[william]

TRUMP: "111 missiles shot a few weeks ago were launched by our lovely friends from Iran, they were aimed at the Abraham Lincoln. Out of the 111 missiles shot, 111 were knocked into the sea."

I'm afraid one of these days they are going to get lucky. Will this administration pull out like Reagan did in Beirut or escalate to all-out war?

By the way, the reason I keep talking about a ground offensive is because to the best of my knowledge no war has ever been won by just air power alone. If it happens here, it will be the first time.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2077704922183926015

 

[GBS61]

o, nations has already won a war without sending ground troops, but this remains an exceptional historical event and a subject of debate among historians. The purest example in modern military history is the Kosovo War (1999). During this operation, dubbed Allied Force, the NATO coalition forced Yugoslav President Slobodan Milošević to capitulate and withdraw his forces solely through a 78-day intensive air campaign, without any Allied soldiers seeing combat on the ground.

This is also a rare occasion for NATO to have been on the offensive rather than the defensive.

But this is extremely rare.

By the way, the reason I keep talking about a ground offensive is because to the best of my knowledge no war has ever been won by just air power alone. If it happens here, it will be the first time.

 

[GBS61]

I'm afraid one of these days they are going to get lucky. Will this administration pull out like Reagan did in Beirut or escalate to all-out war?

By the way, the reason I keep talking about a ground offensive is because to the best of my knowledge no war has ever been won by just air power alone. If it happens here, it will be the first time.

What the US military says: While Donald Trump highlighted this technological feat, the exact details of the incident remain nuanced by military authorities. US Central Command (CENTCOM) confirmed the existence of Iranian missile and drone launches toward the carrier strike group in late winter and spring 2026. The Pentagon has always firmly denied Tehran's claims that the aircraft carrier was hit, stating that the projectiles "didn't even come close" to reaching the ship. The precise figure of 111 missiles launched in one hour remains a figure specific to the president.

Trump says 'Islamic Republic of Japan' fired missiles at US ship

President Donald Trump mistakenly said the "Islamic Republic of Japan" fired 111 missiles at a U.S. aircraft carrier.

www.usatoday.com

 

[william]

o, nations has already won a war without sending ground troops, but this remains an exceptional historical event and a subject of debate among historians. The purest example in modern military history is the Kosovo War (1999). During this operation, dubbed Allied Force, the NATO coalition forced Yugoslav President Slobodan Milošević to capitulate and withdraw his forces solely through a 78-day intensive air campaign, without any Allied soldiers seeing combat on the ground.

Ground forces were present and played a significant role in the 1999 Kosovo War, alongside the NATO-led air campaign.

Yugoslav and Serbian forces
The Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (FRY) deployed large ground forces in and around Kosovo, including 80,000–114,000 soldiers in and near the province, plus 20,000 police and several hundred paramilitary units such as the Šakali, Škorpioni, and White Eagles Wikipedia. These forces engaged the Kosovo Liberation Army (KLA) in direct combat, used artillery and armored units, and conducted ethnic cleansing operations that drove out large numbers of Albanian civilians Wikipedia+1.

NATO and international ground presence
While NATO’s primary 1999 intervention was Operation Allied Force, an air campaign from 24 March to 10 June 1999, it was supported by ground forces. The U.S. Army’s Task Force Hawk was a key component, consisting of about 114,000 NATO troops (including U.S. regulars, allied contingents, and police) deployed to secure the withdrawal of Yugoslav forces and establish a peacekeeping presence. Task Force Hawk’s mission was to ensure compliance with the Kumanovo Agreement, which mandated the withdrawal of Yugoslav military, police, and paramilitary forces and the deployment of an international civil and security presence NATO.

KFOR deployment
Following the Yugoslav withdrawal, the Kosovo Force (KFOR) was established under UN Resolution 1244. KFOR was a NATO-led multinational peacekeeping force with a strong ground component, tasked with maintaining security, protecting civilians, and supporting the return of refugees NATO.

From a Copilot Search

This is also a rare occasion for NATO to have been on the offensive rather than the defensive.

But this is extremely rare.

 

[william]

What the US military says: While Donald Trump highlighted this technological feat, the exact details of the incident remain nuanced by military authorities. US Central Command (CENTCOM) confirmed the existence of Iranian missile and drone launches toward the carrier strike group in late winter and spring 2026. The Pentagon has always firmly denied Tehran's claims that the aircraft carrier was hit, stating that the projectiles "didn't even come close" to reaching the ship. The precise figure of 111 missiles launched in one hour remains a figure specific to the president.

Trump says 'Islamic Republic of Japan' fired missiles at US ship

President Donald Trump mistakenly said the "Islamic Republic of Japan" fired 111 missiles at a U.S. aircraft carrier.

www.usatoday.com

Yes, he made a mistake at the NATO Sumit. He is human. Years from now the truth will come out about iran trying to hit US ships. IMO

https://twitter.com/x/status/2077547463292895341

Beyond stating the incident occurred "a few weeks ago," the President did not specify when the attack took place, how long the engagement lasted, or provide additional operational details. As a result, it remains unclear whether he was describing a single mass missile salvo or multiple launches over a longer period.

The President of the United States gets a daily brief. We don't.

 

[william]

Absolutely, and don't assume they can't. They have a decent cyber warfare system in place.

Hopefully ours is better.

 

[william]

Of course, Russia is doing the same thing with Ukraine. So, is the US behaving like Russia?

There is a big difference in what the US is doing compared to what russia is doing.

Iranian are enjoying the US attack on IRGC positions They will enjoy the fall of regime

https://twitter.com/x/status/2077964764689629623

 

[william]

What the iranians can expect when the DOGS are FINALLY let off their leash! I almost feel sorry for them.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2077883463349485933

 

[Publius]

The list is extremely long.

Famous historical examples:
The Nanking Massacre (1937): Mass atrocities and looting committed by the Japanese army in China.
The Katyn Massacre (1940):

Execution of thousands of Polish officers by the Soviet secret service.
The Oradour-sur-Glane Massacre (1944):

Destruction of a French village and massacre of its 643 inhabitants by a Waffen-SS unit.

Committed by the USA:
Throughout their history, the armed forces and intelligence services of the United States have been accused or found guilty of several serious violations of the laws of war.

The Vietnam War

The My Lai Massacre (1968):
U.S. Army soldiers massacred between 347 and 504 unarmed civilians, primarily women, children, and the elderly, in the village of My Lai. Only one officer, Lieutenant William Calley, was convicted by the U.S. military justice system.

The Massive Use of Agent Orange: The deliberate spraying of millions of liters of this toxic defoliant destroyed ecosystems and poisoned the Vietnamese civilian population, causing cancer and severe birth defects across generations.

The Vietnam War

The My Lai Massacre (1968): U.S. Army soldiers massacred between 347 and 504 unarmed civilians, primarily women, children, and the elderly, in the village of My Lai. Only one officer, Lieutenant William Calley, was convicted by a U.S. military court.

The Korean War

The No Gun Ri Massacre (1950): At the beginning of the conflict, American soldiers from the 7th Cavalry Regiment opened fire on Korean civilian refugees under a railway bridge, killing between 250 and 300 people. The existence of this massacre was officially acknowledged by the U.S. government in 2001.

World War II: The Biscari Massacre (1943): During the invasion of Sicily, soldiers of the U.S. 45th Infantry Division summarily executed 74 Italian prisoners of war and two German prisoners after their surrender. The debate over the atomic bombings (1945): Although they were never prosecuted, the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which caused the instant death of more than 100,000 civilians, are considered by many historians and legal experts to be war crimes due to their disproportionate and indiscriminate nature.

Thank you again for supporting my point. Your cited examples point to direct willful massacres or executions.
NOT the destruction of civilian infrastructure.
I am not saying horrible things don’t happen in war. Things that nations should always try to refrain from doing, and or to condemn.
Accusations of “War crimes” are so liberally and politically motivated today. That some how the example of bombing a bridge to impede traffic is somehow a war crime.

 

[RiffRaff]

Thank you again for supporting my point. Your cited examples point to direct willful massacres or executions.
NOT the destruction of civilian infrastructure.
I am not saying horrible things don’t happen in war. Things that nations should always try to refrain from doing, and or to condemn.
Accusations of “War crimes” are so liberally and politically motivated today. That some how the example of bombing a bridge to impede traffic is somehow a war crime.

The fact that our species has collectively decided that we need "rules" for blowing up your enemy should tell you everything you need to know about us.

Incredibly Off-Topic but still somewhat related to our warlike nature in general:
I was watching a documentary the other day about the different species of hominids that lived on the planet at the same time thousands of years ago. Homo Sapiens and Neanderthals were both very prevalent during the same time period, but they had completely different cultural personalities. Homo Sapiens was relatively peaceful, created small communities and survived primarily on nuts, berries, fruits, and vegetables, although they would eat meat if available. They did not create hunting parties to go out and kill animals.

Neanderthals, however, were apparently extremely violent and ate almost nothing but meat, including Homo Sapiens. And they were fearless, taking on wild animals several times bigger than they were. If Neanderthals raided a Homo Sapiens village, they would kill the men and use them for food, but kidnap the women and use them for... other purposes.

Hence, due to this forced cross-breeding, when Neanderthals went extinct and Homo Sapiens took over the planet, we still carried with us anywhere between 1% and 4% Neanderthal DNA in our genetic code, depending on ancestry. Modern humans of European or Asian descent are more likely to have the higher numbers than those of African descent. Scientists are speculating that the cause behind Homo Sapiens being as violent as we are, even in modern times, can be traced directly to our Neanderthal heritage.

Anyway, it was a fascinating documentary, if you're into that kind of thing.