UA-RU | DISCUSSIONS

Status
Not open for further replies.

REALHumanRights

Power Poster
We hear today a new threat of nuclear weapons use from Russia, this time specific to Ukraine, UK, and USA, from the Dmitry Medvedev, Deputy Chairman of the Security Council of the Russian Federation (former Russia president - once considered "liberalizing" force). MSN news posting has the most complete translation of the quote, but all of them are incomplete, with various news media sources choosing selected words or phrases from the quote. For those looking a security strategy from a fact-based perspective, I have collected his direct Russian quote, and translated it from Google Translate. Of course, I reject Russia's threats against world peace and the invasion of Ukraine. But I believe we need to make judgments for security based on all of the facts, not only selected quotes from media, deciding what we do and do not need to know.

September 27, 2022 - Dmitry Medvedev, Deputy Chairman of the Security Council of the Russian Federation:
"More about the use of nuclear weapons"

"Our enemies love to make grandiloquent statements. Use the terms 'freedom', 'democracy', 'mission'. In fact, this is just ritual verbal diarrhea. Fountains of diarrheic demagoguery coupled with vicious croaking rhetoric, have become a long-proven weapon of the Anglo-Saxon world, with which they flood the rest of humanity in an attempt to defend their exclusivity and the right to rule the world."

"The topic of recent days is the Russian nuclear threat. Biden and Truss, various secondary Blinkens and Sullivans, spraying Atlantic saliva, demand that Russia remove its hand from its 'nuclear button'. Together, they constantly threaten us with 'terrifying' consequences if Russia uses nuclear weapons. And the London aunt, young in mind, is completely ready to immediately begin an exchange of nuclear strikes with our country."

"I have to remind you again - for those deaf who hear only themselves. Russia has the right to use nuclear weapons if necessary. in predetermined cases. In strict accordance with the Fundamentals of State Policy in the Field of Nuclear Deterrence. If we or our allies are attacked using this type of weapon. Or if aggression with the use of conventional weapons threatens the very existence of our state. The President of Russia spoke about this directly recently."

"In addition, we will do everything to prevent the appearance of nuclear weapons in our hostile neighbors. For example, in N*** Ukraine, which is directly controlled today by NATO countries."

"It is pointless to count on the reason and political will of the Kyiv regime. But there is still a fragile hope for common sense and a sense of self-preservation of the enemy countries condoning them. They understand that if the threat to Russia exceeds the established danger limit, we will have to respond. Without asking anyone's permission, without long consultations. And it's definitely not a bluff."

"The question is different. Imagine that Russia is forced to use the most formidable weapon against the Ukrainian regime, which has committed a large-scale act of aggression that is dangerous for the very existence of our state. I believe that NATO will not directly intervene in the conflict even in this situation. After all, the security of Washington, London, Brussels is much more important for the North Atlantic Alliance than the fate of a dying Ukraine that no one needs, even if it is abundantly supplied with various weapons. The supply of modern weapons is just a business for Western countries, however, heavily implicated in hatred towards us. No more. Overseas and European demagogues are not going to perish in a nuclear apocalypse. Therefore, they will swallow the use of any weapon in the current conflict. Something like this…"

"It would be nice if this sad conclusion was at least partially realized by the authorities in Kyiv. Alas, it's almost impossible. They are in constant war frenzy with short pauses for bizarre drug dreams."
 

REALHumanRights

Power Poster
Dmitry Medvedev: "And the London aunt, young in mind, is completely ready to immediately begin an exchange of nuclear strikes with our country."
Russia Medvedev reference to Truss was the first I have heard of the new UK Prime Minister Truss and the topic of nuclear weapons.
The transcript of UK PM Truss September 21 statement at the United Nations is here. At that address, she does not mention nuclear weapons. Her remarks regarding Ukraine and Russia, and pledging MLRS rockets to Ukraine (which are similar in being able to fire the same familiy of munitions as HIMARS):
"And we must go further to friendshore our supply chains and end strategic dependence. This is how we will build collective security, strengthen our resilience and safeguard freedom and democracy. But we cannot let up on dealing with the crisis we face today. No-one is threatening Russia. Yet, as we meet here this evening… In Ukraine, barbarous weapons are being used to kill and maim people, Rape is being used as an instrument of war, Families are being torn apart. And this morning we have seen Putin trying to justify his catastrophic failures. He is doubling down by sending even more reservists to a terrible fate. He is desperately trying to claim the mantle of democracy for a regime without human rights or freedoms. And he is making yet more bogus claims and sabre-rattling threats. This will not work. The international alliance is strong and Ukraine is strong. The contrast between Russia’s conduct and Ukraine’s brave, dignified First Lady, Olena Zelenska, who is here at the UN today, could not be more stark. The Ukrainians are not just defending their own country – they are defending our values and the security of the whole world. That’s why we must act. That’s why the UK will spend 3% of GDP on defence by 2030, maintaining our position as the leading security actor in Europe. And that’s why – at this crucial moment in the conflict – I pledge that we will sustain or increase our military support to Ukraine, for as long as it takes. New UK weapons are arriving in Ukraine as I speak – including more MLRS rockets. We will not rest until Ukraine prevails. In all of these areas, on all of these fronts, the time to act is now. This is a decisive moment in our history, in the history of this organisation, and in the history of freedom. The story of 2022 could have been that of an authoritarian state rolling its tanks over the border of a peaceful neighbour and subjugating its people. Instead, it is the story of freedom fighting back. In the face of rising aggression we have shown we have the power to act and the resolve to see it through. But this cannot be a one-off. This must be a new era in which we commit to ourselves, our citizens, and this institution that we will do whatever it takes – whatever it takes to deliver for our people and defend our values."

However, in a UK interview with Times Radio host John Pienaar, on August 24 reported by Yahoo News UK, PM Truss stated her readiness to use nukes. This was apparently at a Tory Party leadership husting in Birmingham.
Question: "Your orders to our Trident boat captain on whether you, prime minister Liz Truss, is giving the order to unleash nuclear weapons. It would mean global annihilation. I won't ask you if you would press the button, you'll say yes, but faced with that task I would feel physically sick. How does that thought make you feel?"
Answer: Truss replied without emotion: "I think it's an important duty of the prime minister and I'm ready to do that." Pressed on how it would make her feel, she said: "I'm ready to do that."

I have not seen a UK PM Truss quote specific to exchanging nuclear missiles with Russia, as alleged by Russia's Medeved. Note: that does not mean it does not exist, just what I have seen in open source information. Russia propaganda is working hard to play up her statements to Times Radio on the nuclear threat. Facts matter. But we have to have the facts to be able to combat propaganda -- from any source.
 

dryjoy

Active member
I seem to recall Truss made some remarks of questionable judgement earlier in the year when she was Foreign Secretary. It might have been about wanting to destroy the Russian regime or something like that. I can’t remember the detail, but it was fairly inflammatory.
 

REALHumanRights

Power Poster
Dmitry Medvedev: "And the London aunt, young in mind, is completely ready to immediately begin an exchange of nuclear strikes with our country."
What is notable in the UK media, not only is there no pushback on this statement, there is not even reporting on the new Russia nuclear threats, now addressing UK and London. Is it illegal to report in UK?

Times.jpgTelegraph.jpgBBC.jpg
 

Braver911

Member
We hear today a new threat of nuclear weapons use from Russia, this time specific to Ukraine, UK, and USA, from the Dmitry Medvedev, Deputy Chairman of the Security Council of the Russian Federation (former Russia president - once considered "liberalizing" force). MSN news posting has the most complete translation of the quote, but all of them are incomplete, with various news media sources choosing selected words or phrases from the quote. For those looking a security strategy from a fact-based perspective, I have collected his direct Russian quote, and translated it from Google Translate. Of course, I reject Russia's threats against world peace and the invasion of Ukraine. But I believe we need to make judgments for security based on all of the facts, not only selected quotes from media, deciding what we do and do not need to know.

September 27, 2022 - Dmitry Medvedev, Deputy Chairman of the Security Council of the Russian Federation:
"More about the use of nuclear weapons"

"Our enemies love to make grandiloquent statements. Use the terms 'freedom', 'democracy', 'mission'. In fact, this is just ritual verbal diarrhea. Fountains of diarrheic demagoguery coupled with vicious croaking rhetoric, have become a long-proven weapon of the Anglo-Saxon world, with which they flood the rest of humanity in an attempt to defend their exclusivity and the right to rule the world."

"The topic of recent days is the Russian nuclear threat. Biden and Truss, various secondary Blinkens and Sullivans, spraying Atlantic saliva, demand that Russia remove its hand from its 'nuclear button'. Together, they constantly threaten us with 'terrifying' consequences if Russia uses nuclear weapons. And the London aunt, young in mind, is completely ready to immediately begin an exchange of nuclear strikes with our country."

"I have to remind you again - for those deaf who hear only themselves. Russia has the right to use nuclear weapons if necessary. in predetermined cases. In strict accordance with the Fundamentals of State Policy in the Field of Nuclear Deterrence. If we or our allies are attacked using this type of weapon. Or if aggression with the use of conventional weapons threatens the very existence of our state. The President of Russia spoke about this directly recently."

"In addition, we will do everything to prevent the appearance of nuclear weapons in our hostile neighbors. For example, in N*** Ukraine, which is directly controlled today by NATO countries."

"It is pointless to count on the reason and political will of the Kyiv regime. But there is still a fragile hope for common sense and a sense of self-preservation of the enemy countries condoning them. They understand that if the threat to Russia exceeds the established danger limit, we will have to respond. Without asking anyone's permission, without long consultations. And it's definitely not a bluff."

"The question is different. Imagine that Russia is forced to use the most formidable weapon against the Ukrainian regime, which has committed a large-scale act of aggression that is dangerous for the very existence of our state. I believe that NATO will not directly intervene in the conflict even in this situation. After all, the security of Washington, London, Brussels is much more important for the North Atlantic Alliance than the fate of a dying Ukraine that no one needs, even if it is abundantly supplied with various weapons. The supply of modern weapons is just a business for Western countries, however, heavily implicated in hatred towards us. No more. Overseas and European demagogues are not going to perish in a nuclear apocalypse. Therefore, they will swallow the use of any weapon in the current conflict. Something like this…"

"It would be nice if this sad conclusion was at least partially realized by the authorities in Kyiv. Alas, it's almost impossible. They are in constant war frenzy with short pauses for bizarre drug dreams."
Wow, somebody needs to ask this guy if he wants to be the pot or the kettle!
 

DarkNoon

Dedicated Moderator
Staff member
If governments decided not to reveal this intelligence,
It will. A whistle blower would leak it. A story that big no way they can keep a lid on it for long.

Also yes I have faith OSINT community would find this out someway somehow.
 

dryjoy

Active member
Dmitry Medvedev: "And the London aunt, young in mind, is completely ready to immediately begin an exchange of nuclear strikes with our country."
What is notable in the UK media, not only is there no pushback on this statement, there is not even reporting on the new Russia nuclear threats, now addressing UK and London. Is it illegal to report in UK?

View attachment 2730View attachment 2731View attachment 2729
No of course it’s not illegal to report this in the U.K.

We and our media are very preoccupied with our government’s economic mis-management and developing currency crisis at the moment.
 

NamelessOne

Active member
Dmitry Medvedev: "And the London aunt, young in mind, is completely ready to immediately begin an exchange of nuclear strikes with our country."
What is notable in the UK media, not only is there no pushback on this statement, there is not even reporting on the new Russia nuclear threats, now addressing UK and London. Is it illegal to report in UK?

View attachment 2730View attachment 2731View attachment 2729

No it's not illegal, it's just Russia has become the boy that cried wolf
 

dryjoy

Active member
Another statement from the west that nuclear weapons use by Russia would be unacceptable.

Obviously the referenda are taking place at the moment, but other than that the latest threats from Russia are similar to all the rest over the past 6 months.

Do you think the statements in response from the west have been louder/firmer/more numerous than they have been up until now? Or are they similar? Seems like they are louder to me, but I’m aware might I just be more tuned in to it as the whole thing with the mobilisation and the referendums have got me watching things more closely.

Latest NATO statement re: use of nuclear weapons
 

chiari

Member
Of course it was the USA that sabotaged the gas pipeline, Europe won't have cheap gas now, Nancy Pelosi bought shares in the liquefied gas energy company a few days ago. Germany and all of Europe will once again be the big losers in this war.

Ícone Verificada pela comunidade
 

DEFCON Warning System

Director
Staff member
Another statement from the west that nuclear weapons use by Russia would be unacceptable.

Obviously the referenda are taking place at the moment, but other than that the latest threats from Russia are similar to all the rest over the past 6 months.

Do you think the statements in response from the west have been louder/firmer/more numerous than they have been up until now? Or are they similar? Seems like they are louder to me, but I’m aware might I just be more tuned in to it as the whole thing with the mobilisation and the referendums have got me watching things more closely.

Latest NATO statement re: use of nuclear weapons
Awful lot of talk about nuclear war. Likely because Russia has been blustering about it.

At the beginning, I wasn't worried about what Russia would do, but what NATO would think Russia would do.

Now I'm starting to worry about what Russia would do.

I don't like this line of thinking.
 

Peace

Active member
Ukraine is about to be destroyed. After the areas become part of Russia you will see the systematic destruction of the country. What will be the response to Nord Stream 1 & 2? North-sea gas, Norway pipeline, or maybe the new polish pipeline. Accidents are going start happening soon!!! If the US was trying to prevent governments from caving over winter might have made it so much worse.
 

REALHumanRights

Power Poster
Another statement from the west that nuclear weapons use by Russia would be unacceptable.

Obviously the referenda are taking place at the moment, but other than that the latest threats from Russia are similar to all the rest over the past 6 months.

Do you think the statements in response from the west have been louder/firmer/more numerous than they have been up until now? Or are they similar? Seems like they are louder to me, but I’m aware might I just be more tuned in to it as the whole thing with the mobilisation and the referendums have got me watching things more closely.

Latest NATO statement re: use of nuclear weapons
I read it as Russia's statements on nuclear weapons have been "louder/firmer/more numerous," and Western representatives feel they must speak back.
I agree with NATO lead that nuclear war "must never be fought." But the problem is having USA in NATO then, because it is obviously hypocritcal that the only nation on Earth that has conducted nuclear war is the leader in NATO, the USA. We can reject the Russia threats and condemn its cruel invasion of Ukraine, and still understand this hypocrisy.
If Europe had the foresight to create its own defense organization, or if it took the leadership of NATO away from the USA, then that would be a different postion.
 

dryjoy

Active member
Awful lot of talk about nuclear war. Likely because Russia has been blustering about it.

At the beginning, I wasn't worried about what Russia would do, but what NATO would think Russia would do.

Now I'm starting to worry about what Russia would do.

I don't like this line of thinking.
No I don’t like that either. I’m finding it hard to get a read on it all at the moment. Apart from the question as to the extent to which Russia is really bluffing at the moment, there must surely be a heightened risk of misinterpretation and miscalculation at the moment.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top