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UA-RU-NATO War & Ukraine Peace Talks | DISCUSSIONS

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Cilvilt_beredskap said:
When Nato was united? Of course he wouldn't want a war, it'd result in escalation that could mean nuclear war and the destruction of Russia. If you haven't ignored his comments about returning "rightfully Russian land" in Ukraine that's not about the NATO expansion it's very similar to comments made by previous Russian imperial Tsars about the Baltics, Poland, and even Sweden back in the day. If he had a chance to get leverage over Eastern Europe, he would. Or do you think the symbolism of Imperial Russia and the Soviet Union is just for show? Part of it might be, but the language around spheres of influence and historical territory is the same that Russia has always used when it wants to expand. If Sweden and Finland hadn't joined NATO there would have been a real chance it would have gone after Gotland. Plus, Ukraine is a similar enough culture living aligned to the west, which will always be a threat to Putin, especially if Ukraine has the chance to turn into a stable and healthy democracy well integrated with the west. NATO is simply a means of a guarantee of Russia not invading to prevent that, because Ukraine prospering is a signal to the Russians that there is an alternative to the authoritarianism they have been living under for so long, which in turn is a threat to Putin's power. As long as a democratic independent Ukraine exists it will be a problem for Putin that he wants to solve, either by installing a new Porochenko or invading later if there are no security guarantees for the west. A NATO membership isn't a threat to Russia, just a threat to Putin's rule since it means that a democratic nation which similarish culture and cultural exchange can exist unchallenged and might cause the previously politically apathetic population to see that there are alternatives.
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There’s a reason Ukraine wants in NATO it has everything to do with Putin wanting it back and Ukraine not wanting to rejoin Russia. But Russia not really doing anything about Sweden and Finland joining NATO with little Russian response shows Russia doesn’t necessarily have an issue with any of its neighbors joining NATO. There’s something inherently different about Ukraine to the Russians and more specifically to Putin. When Putin published his article about the historical relationship between the two countries it’s different than any of the other Eastern European countries. Does that mean if they weren’t NATO members Putin would’ve challenged them? Not necessarily but there’s a reason Putin has accepted the status quo in Georgia but continued pushing into Ukraine. Crimea was one of the Crown Jewels of the Soviet Union and Putin wanted his place in Russian history by returning that crown jewel, when the Ukrainians threatened the hold on it Putin reacted as if a brother stabbed him in the back because that’s how he views Ukrainians and Russians. If you’re able to read through propaganda and not get brainwashed by it I’d suggest reading Putin’s 2021 article on the relationship between Ukraine and Russia it gives an insight into how he thinks about it.
 
US Secretary of State Marco Rubio: The West will have to lift sanctions against the Russian Federation in the event of a settlement of the war in Ukraine.
https://twitter.com/x/status/1891846873301839984
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Yup Trump going to give everything to Putin. More then certain Putin been having some tremendous parties thanks to his puppet in The White House. Let's reward Putin for his behavior. Really want to know what lube Trump prefers.
 
DarkNoon said:
Yup Trump going to give everything to Putin. More then certain Putin been having some tremendous parties thanks to his puppet in The White House. Let's reward Putin for his behavior. Really want to know what lube Trump prefers.
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Literally nothing has been settled yet can we wait for an actual settlement before we keep throwing stuff like this out.
 
Dr Arthur said:
Just a question. Do they use nose rings in camels like I have in cattle?
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I’m not an expert but although I have seen a few shot (they were in the way) I have not seen a nose ring.

However if those savages did have nose rings available they would put them in the female chattel second… after they removed the breeders clitoris’s with rusty nail clippers.

Remember, “girls are for breeding, boys are for fun.”

I can’t believe we spent 20 years trying to to help that teaming cesspool of amoral flotsam

Oh wait I’m starting to drift a bit of subject….
 
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Torch said:
I’m not an expert but although I have seen a few shot (they were in the way) I have not seen a nose ring.

However if those savages did have nose rings available they would put them in the female chattel second… after they removed the breeders clitoris’s with rusty nail clippers.

Remember, “girls are for breeding, boys are for fun.”

I can’t believe we spent 20 years trying to to help that teaming cesspool of amoral flotsam

Oh wait I’m starting to get a bit of subject….
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Know exactly how you feel. Some are just far to backward to help. You are probably right and despite may experiences I also have never remembered seeing a camel with a nose ring though I have seen many in their harem members.
 
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DarkNoon said:
US Secretary of State Marco Rubio: The West will have to lift sanctions against the Russian Federation in the event of a settlement of the war in Ukraine.
https://twitter.com/x/status/1891846873301839984

Told you, Trump to reward Putin for his behavior. 🤮
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So, you are in favor of keeping extreme pressure on russia after hostilities have stopped? That didn't work out so well after WWI. We got WWII!
I think the west should bring russia on board against the rising threat in the east.
 
DarkNoon said:
Yup Trump going to give everything to Putin. More then certain Putin been having some tremendous parties thanks to his puppet in The White House. Let's reward Putin for his behavior. Really want to know what lube Trump prefers.
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Well given we don’t know the terms of this settlement crying foul is a bit premature. But IF an agreed upon agreement by all parties is reached.
Then exactly how long are sanctions supposed to remain in place. A decade, in perpetuity?

Remember this has become a stalemate war. Billions of weapons systems have gone to Ukraine. In saying this I again ask, do you have a plan to win this war?

Personally I see no path to victory without the introduction of NATO troops. I’ve actually said this needed to be done a year ago. But the past administration refused to commit to that as has virtually all European nations.

So once more there hasn’t been a path to victory. What exactly shall we expect the new administration to pull out of their ass to lead us to victory that no other NaTO leader has presented to win.

If NATO wants to rescue Ukraine in total. Then they should already have divisions of warfighters encamped on Polands Eastern Border ready to go and only one day from engaging the evil Russians.

A military operation like this takes time, logistics, and vast resources . Why have they not already started if they are so deeply committed to going to Ukraines rescue.

Mindlessly talking tough and sending bullets can only buy you so much.

Now if Putin is consistent and is a jerk about terms.
Then we’re back to square one.
 
I'm frankly very surprised that Trump blamed Ukraine for "starting it". Not sure what other indications we need to know that Trump is planning to fuck over Ukraine.
 
Do we know how many extra volunteers have traveled recently to Ukraine - I asume, this disinformation rhetoric is going to call up more help and volunteers for Ukraine ( asuming people get emotional over it, and goverments can use it to get more things done )
 
alphaecho said:
russia offered Trump a deal on russian natural resources - oil and access to the Arctic, — The Moscow Times.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1892186159343706162
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The deals are not through negotiation but the handwritting is on the wall. Ukrain gets used, abused, and screwed once again.

"Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved." (Matthew 24:12-13)

"Those who want to get rich fall into temptation and a trap and into many foolish and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction. For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs." (1 Timothy 6:9-10)"

"A perverse person stirs up conflict, and a gossip separates close friends. A violent person entices their neighbor and leads them down a path thatis not good." (Proverbs 16:28-29)

"My enemies say of me in malice, “When will he die and his name perish?” When one of them comes to see me, he speaks falsely, while his heart gathers slander; then he goes outand spreads it around. All my enemies whisper together against me; they imagine the worst for me, saying, 'A vile disease has afflicted him; he will never get up from the place where he lies.' Even my close friend, someone I trusted, one who shared my bread, has turned against me." (Psalm 41:5-9)
 
DarkNoon said:
Fools dream as the expression goes. I see Putin has the entire right fooled speaking of. :(
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The “entire right” doesn’t see the need for WW3 over Crimea. It’s a Nuclear War thing. Very nuanced. So long as Moscow has been defeated, in Kiev, much of the eastern territories are ethnic Russians and happy to be enslaved.

Personally 1,000,000 Russian casualties seems like a good stiff price. There is also the fact that the US lied to Russia about NATO expansion. Now I’m not saying we are wrong or that free people shouldn’t pick whether to join or not. I’m just saying the Russians have a point. Not just feeling like you were lied to allow you to rape and pillage your neighboring countries? Hell no. I’m just saying that it’s a slight mitigation and that while we, the west, are on the side of Angels, we sure as hell are not angels.
 
Sad, truly sad, even you have been fooled by piss poor Russian propaganda. Empty fake red lines and threats. Spare me please. 🤮🥱 So what, reward Russia for its behavior cause your "scared".

Only people in danger is our children's future because where going to embolden and reward Putin for his behavior which means Ukraine will not be the last, 100% guaranteed won't be the last time we see Putin move on Europe.

Really sad borderline repugnant. Thought a lot of you where smarter and better then this. :(

<self snip, removing unneeded jabs>
 
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Loadstain said:
The U.S. reportedly is done covering Europe’s defense tab.Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth made it clear: NATO allies must spend more on their own security, with a push for defense budgets to hit 5% of GDP—far beyond the 2% NATO target that most still ignore.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1892058651646386677
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Anyone else find it ironic how the Europeans complained about American military bases in their countries for the past couple decades now they complain that we don’t want to bare the entirety of their funding? It’s wild to me that it’s been 17 years since Putin invaded Georgia and Europe was supposedly having a wake up call but here we are they are effectively completely reliant on the United States for defense but complain when we ask them to contribute more to their own defense. They know the United States has been planning to pivot to Asia for at least a decade now, hell Obama criticized Mitt Romney for calling Russia a potential threat, yet they drag their feet and more then likely will go back to buying Russian oil and energy to prop up their economy cheaply and then say it’s time to wake up again in 5/10 years when Putin tries to take the rest of Ukraine.
 
DarkNoon said:
Sad, even you have been fooled by piss poor Russian propaganda. Empty fake red lines and threats. Spare me please. 🤮🥱 So what, reward Russia for its behavior cause your "scared". Fucking get out here with that weak ass Russian propaganda talking point.

Really sad borderline repugnant or pathetic. Thought a lot of you where smarter and better then this. Guess I was wrong about a lot of you.
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Russia doesn’t deserve to be rewarded but can you give an honest realistic answer of how to end this war? Find me one war in human history where the side that is currently advancing gives up more than the side that’s losing territory. If Europe really cared about Ukraine winning they’d get serious about defense spending and do something, it’s quite clear they have zero intention of doing that and would rather keep their social spending. So if nobody is going to actually help Ukraine win this thing then what is the point of continuing to let thousands of people die?
 
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